meijin
Senior Member
Tokyo
Japanese
- Sep 30, 2020
- #1
Hi, when you find the person you are talking to (in a bar etc.) good-looking and sexually alluring, you might say "You're attractive".
What about charming? For example, if one of your colleagues (regardless of gender) is a very friendly and likeable person, would you say "You're charming"?
What about appealing? To what kind of person would you say "You're appealing"? Someone who is interesting and likeable but not particularly friendly?
london calling
Senior Member
Salerno, Italy
UK English
- Sep 30, 2020
- #2
Good heavens, I very much doubt I'd ever say anything of the sort to someone I'm attracted to. Too direct.
However, if you put my back to the wall I'd say attractive or charming. 'Appealing' is something I'd say about a kitten or a puppy.
heypresto
Senior Member
South East England
English - England
- Sep 30, 2020
- #3
I can't imagine telling someone they are charming or appealing.
We might call someone charming in an ironic or sarcastic way, but never in a sincere way.
london calling
Senior Member
Salerno, Italy
UK English
- Sep 30, 2020
- #4
heypresto said:
I can't imagine telling someone they are charming or appealing.
We might call someone charming in an ironic or sarcastic way, but never in a sincere way.
You're right.😊
As an added note "You're a real charmer!" is definitely sarcastic and would have your suitor running for their life. 🤣
meijin
Senior Member
Tokyo
Japanese
- Sep 30, 2020
- #5
Thanks both. What about telling your friend "Your husband/wife is charming" when they aren't there? Does it simply mean "I like your husband/wife because he/she is very friendly"? Or does "charming" mean more than that?
london calling said:
'Appealing' is something I'd say about a kitten or a puppy.
What makes a kitten or puppy "appealing" instead of "attractive" or "charming"?
london calling
Senior Member
Salerno, Italy
UK English
- Sep 30, 2020
- #6
meijin said:
Thanks both. What about telling your friend "Your husband/wife is charming" when they aren't there? Does it simply mean "I like your husband/wife because he/she is very friendly"? Or does "charming" mean more than that?
It doesn't mean friendly.
Charming - WordReference.com Dictionary of EnglishWhat makes a kitten or puppy "appealing" instead of "attractive" or "charming"?
Usage. 😊
kentix
Senior Member
English - U.S.
- Sep 30, 2020
- #7
Yes, in our culture you would never say "You're attractive" to someone that bluntly. You would say that to someone else when discussing the person.
meijin
Senior Member
Tokyo
Japanese
- Sep 30, 2020
- #8
london calling said:
It doesn't mean friendly.
So would you say the two dictionaries below are very much mistaken?
Collins COBUILD
If you describe someone as charming, you mean they behave in a friendly, pleasant way that makes people like them.
LEXICO
(of a person or their manner) very polite, friendly, and likeable.
kentix said:
Yes, in our culture you would never say "You're attractive" to someone that bluntly.
Even sexual harassers don't say it?
Myridon
Senior Member
Texas
English - US
- Sep 30, 2020
- #9
meijin said:
So would you say the two dictionaries below are very much mistaken?
Both definitions combine "friendly" with something else. "Friendly and likable" doesn't mean "friendly".
B
Barque
Banned
Tamil
- Oct 1, 2020
- #10
meijin said:
So would you say the two dictionaries below are very much mistaken?
That definition lists the things that constitute charm. It's a combination of friendliness and pleasantness and making the other person feel good that makes you charming.
I wouldn't go so far as to say that people would never say "You're attractive" to someone directly. It's possible in some situations--where you think bluntness might be forgiven, or appreciated, or if you're speaking to a friend you know very well.
Similarly, you might say "You're charming" if you were speaking to a friend--perhaps to reassure them during a period of low self-confidence or something.
Last edited:
meijin
Senior Member
Tokyo
Japanese
- Oct 1, 2020
- #11
Barque said:
That definition list the things that constitute charm. It's a combination of friendliness and pleasantness and making the other person feel good that makes you charming.
Well, but the same dictionary says "Someone who is pleasant is friendly and likeable." (Collins COBUILD)
So, someone who is charming is pleasant (=friendly and likeable), friendly, and likeable, and that's why I wrote "I like your husband/wife because he/she is very friendly". If they are likeable not just because they are friendly, why are they likeable?
P
Ponyprof
Senior Member
Canadian English
- Oct 1, 2020
- #12
meijin said:
Well, but the same dictionary says "Someone who is pleasant is friendly and likeable." (Collins COBUILD)
So, someone who is charming is pleasant (=friendly and likeable), friendly, and likeable, and that's why I wrote "I like your husband/wife because he/she is very friendly". If they are likeable not just because they are friendly, why are they likeable?
There are nuances here that probably escape a dictionary.
I understand a charming person has an extra flair or outgoingness or magnetic quality that makes most people be drawn to them, indeed allows them to cast a spell over people and charm them.
Many many people are pleasant, friendly, and likable, decent people and good friends, but they are not charming.
Indeed, you might start to see through a charming person after a while and think they were manipulative or flirtatious.
It's also true that the description charming probably had its heyday earlier in the 20th century when people could play familiarity and personal interest off against formal manners and social norms. Once things get very very casual, it's hard to know what would constitute charm.
I agree that we tend not to say "you are charming/ attractive/ appealing" directly to people. If we want to complement them or express an interest we are likely to make a more specific comment.
lentulax
Senior Member
Cumbria , England
UK English
- Oct 1, 2020
- #13
There are lots of reasons why someone might be likeable - friendliness is just one. Dictionary definitions are often obliged to be brief - too brief to capture a nuanced and elusive concept like charm. Here are some pointers : the original meaning of 'charm' as a 'magic spell' - the charmer casts a sort of spell over people; it is very difficult to resist being attracted to him; and it is difficult to say why this is so. We say ' to put on the charm' - the charmer may often be physically attractive, but not by any means necessarily - after all, you can't 'put on' a handsome or cute nose, etc.; but it suggests 'charm' can be cultivated or assumed, and indeed the notion of social skills, good manners, the ability to adapt to those one is in contact with in a way that suggests your genuine interest in them, is often a key element in the notion of 'charming'; this is why 'charm' can often be associated with suspicion, and can be used with a negative nuance, and why we not infrequently find the word 'genuinely' attached to 'charming', to reassure the listener that the charm of the person you're describing is rooted in genuine empathy, etc. So 'charm' has something in common with 'charisma', though they're not the same ('charismatic' suggests more the notion of commanding, in ways difficult to explain, admiration and submission, as much as affection and devotion).
Edit : cross-posted with Ponyprof#12
B
Barque
Banned
Tamil
- Oct 1, 2020
- #14
The problem is that dictionaries can't use the same word to define a word. They have to explain them using other words which aren't exact synonyms. And there are hardly any exact synonyms anyway, so there's a certain feel that each word has that you may not always get from the dictionary.
To answer your earlier question:
meijin said:
What about telling your friend "Your husband/wife is charming" when they aren't there?
Yes, this is possible. If you're a man speaking to a man, the tone in which you compliment his wife could matter. If you're a man speaking to a woman, don't say it; it sounds odd, at least to me, for a man to compliment another by calling him charming. A man could however refer to (rather than call), another man as a charming man in some contexts. But I can well imagine a woman speaking to someone about their spouse and saying "Your husband/wife is charming".
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.